Speaker 1 0:00
Hello and welcome to this week's episode of midlife AF. This week we talk about something quite interesting. We talk about servitude. We talk about the concept of serving others before ourself. Selflessness, the sort of indoctrinated conditioning, certainly of the female assigned at birth humans, that it's selfish to put ourselves first, to take up space, to ask for what we need, and that we should always be thinking of others and put others before ourselves. And we question that. Talk about it a little bit because, you know, it's one of the reasons that people stay drinking, is this belief that they have to constantly be pushing themselves in service of everybody else and external validation appearances, but just always not really having any boundaries at all. And we also talk about the anger that that creates, and also the loneliness that can be the root cause of the you know, we have, yes, we have our conditioning. Yes, we have intergenerational conditioning. But also, you know, the root cause can often be fear of abandonment, fear of being left alone, fear of rejection. You know, this whole fitting in and belonging, that kind of sits at the core, the bottom of the cornerstone of everything human wise. All right, my darlings over to me. If you're a woman in midlife whose intuition is telling you that giving booze the elbow might be the next right move, then midlife. AF is the podcast for you join counselor, psychotherapist, this naked mind and gray area drinking alcohol coach Emma Gilmore for a weekly natter about parenting, quirky teens, menopause, relationships and navigating this thing called midlife alcohol free. If you're feeling that life could be so much more that you're sick and tired of doing all the things for everyone else, if your intuition is waving her arms manically at you, saying, It could all be so much easier if we didn't have to keep drinking. Come with me together. We'll find our groove without booze.
Speaker 1 2:42
I lovingly acknowledge the boon people of the Kulon nation as the custodians of Kurt Baroque. I share my admiration for the Aboriginal culture. I witness the connection that they have for each other and the land and their community. As I swim in the waters and walk on the land. I feel the power of this place. I'm grateful for the Aboriginal people's amazing custodianship, the power, beauty and the healing potential of this place. I wish to pay special respects to the elders of the boon people, their wisdom, guidance and support are exceptional and felt well beyond the Aboriginal community, I honor that this is Aboriginal land and that it has never been ceded. I am committed to listening to the Aboriginal community and learning how I can be an active ally in their journey to justice. I thought we'd carry on a bit of a theme we've been talking about in be the lighthouse around servitude. And, you know, this is one of the things that when I work with people with alcohol, one of the things when, you know, do my, you know, my webinars, my master classes, one of the things I have, as you know, kind of a primary requirement if you are going to be living an alcohol free life, which feels like freedom, not restriction, is that You have to matter the most, and this is one of the things that people find the hardest, I think, and it's often we don't even realize that we don't matter to ourselves. We may even think that we're very confident, we're very outgoing, we have a lot of social connections. We may think that our, you know, we have, you know we we 100% value ourselves and we love ourselves very much. We're, you know. We may not, but we may, and this can be a real blind spot for us. And I think. It's a little bit to do with conditioning. Hello, Mel. How are you nice to see you? Little bit to do with conditioning. In that we've been kind of sold this concept of what living a good life as a woman looks like, and to all intensive purposes. A lot of us can feel like we're achieving that, and yet there's we're still having to drink. Because, you know what the and it's interesting, particularly for women in midlife, because often when the estrogen and the
Unknown Speaker 5:41
starts to get low,
Speaker 1 5:45
that's when our nurturing hormones start to fade. And so this concept of servitude and I was talking in group last night. I was someone started drilling. I hope that's not too distracting.
Unknown Speaker 6:01
Hopefully you can't hear it. That's loud.
Unknown Speaker 6:08
Hi, Kylie, good to see you.
Speaker 1 6:10
Tell me, Kylie, I know you probably won't be on for long, but can you hear some drilling? Because I've got they can hear a drill in the background. I want to know if it's coming across on the line. Do line, it's going there, yeah, so this concept of served you, and I was saying, you know that I have had people in group who consider you know where I say you have to matter most. You actually have to matter more than anybody else in order for you to live your happy uncle free life.
Unknown Speaker 6:49
Because
Unknown Speaker 6:51
while you are
Speaker 1 6:56
outwardly focused, you're neglecting self, and while self is neglected, self is suppressed, and self is exhausted, and
Unknown Speaker 7:11
it's that sort of, you know,
Speaker 1 7:14
yes, we should have systems and structures that support us, that mean that we As human beings aren't completely burnt out and exhausted by the expectations of the world.
Unknown Speaker 7:26
And so, you know, I
Speaker 1 7:27
do get a little bit frustrated with especially guys. There's a guy on Instagram at the moment and an autistic guy, you know, talking about self care and how important it is, particularly for parents of neurodivergent children, and, you know, a couple of people written in the comments, yeah, that's great. But self care is like, again, it's like, the onus is on self, not the systems and structures. But I definitely think there is an issue with our systems and structures that they don't support us. And I definitely think that this idea, particularly female assigned, assigned at birth, humans that we've been indoctrinated in. And one of my clients was telling me about there's a particular and I'll find it from her and share it another day. But there is a particular thing that is more common for neurodivergent humans, in which case I imagine that it is for anyone who identifies as a sensitive or an intuitive human as well that we take on the beliefs of other people. We in we hold the beliefs of other people. Very easily, much more easily so we get passed down generational, intergenerational. Hello, honey, honey.
Unknown Speaker 8:52
It's nice name
Speaker 1 8:55
Donna Marie. Very nice. Just talking about sort of intergenerational hand me downs in terms of values, and, you know, particularly servitude. And I remember as a my mum would never sit down until she had finished doing all her jobs and chores. And her mum was the same, and I took that into my life. Not I wasn't never as because I was, I've always been very ADHD quite.
Unknown Speaker 9:34
I masked very well
Speaker 1 9:35
as an organized person, but I wasn't really that that well, but I managed to keep on top of my stuff until I had children, and then having two autistic children, ADHD children. It just all got too much for me, and I found that I wasn't able to I was I was getting so stressed out and anxious about trying to keep it. Everything as it should be. And you know, people would probably laugh when they came out to us, but he really not keeping house for a while, but, but what I mean is, you know, I had this sort of expectation that I would leave for work and, you know, my counters would be wiped down. There wouldn't be any washing up in the sink and whatnot, the kids would get to school, and of course, I didn't realize at the time, but my kids were ADHD and autistic, and that meant that actually, you know, that whole transition from being asleep to being awake and out of the door was incredibly long and incredibly time consuming and very specific requirements of me. And had a requirement as well, that I would be calm and steady. And, you know, I found that whole thing very, very stressful, to the point where, when my kids were young, I used to just, we used to just go out, not and to stay stay out all day, mainly because I just didn't want the mess at home. I'd be like, well, cheered up.
Unknown Speaker 11:07
We've got out. Everything's out, right? We'll
Speaker 1 11:09
stay out. I was also because my kids wouldn't go to sleep at home during the day, and that was just It used to stress me out so much trying to get them to go to sleep. And I never could. We ended up having to go I drove past it the other day and I got this kind of like, kind of like trauma response. Tweedle, it's like a sleep school. We went in there for a week. My poor children were made to beef in separate rooms and cry themselves to exhaustion,
Unknown Speaker 11:38
not my best parenting decisions.
Unknown Speaker 11:44
But servitude. So
Speaker 1 11:48
it's taught to us by our parents, by our mothers, by our maybe our dads, to a certain extent as well. You know, I see a lot of men pottering around, never still, always organizing. There's something of an anxiety about it, isn't it? It's like the sort of need to control our environment so
Unknown Speaker 12:09
that we feel safe,
Speaker 1 12:13
but in terms of servitude. So there's that side of things as like appearances, if everything's organized, if everything's tidy, you know, if I'm doing all the things on the list, and I'll be okay. But the other part of servitude is about giving out, and if you put yourself first, then you the deconditioning is that we believe ourselves to be lazy, or up ourselves, or taking up too much space, or being a, you know, proud, Poppy kind of thing. And I was saying to the group, I've had people leave group, because when I say, you have to matter most. Your needs have to matter most. And they say, I can't stop doing the things that making me so exhausted that I have to drink to relieve the overwhelm, the sensory overload that I'm experiencing. I can't not go and see my granny and sit for four hours in her house
Unknown Speaker 13:29
at Christmas,
Speaker 1 13:33
because there are obligations that we just have to make in life. And, you know, not being able to. And I, I totally get this right, because this is how we've been conditioned. And it's a bit like, you know, people talk about going out on dates, and it's like, well, what do we do on dates? You know, we don't want to again, it's about taking up space, putting your needs first, asking for what you want. But often people will say, Well, I can't not drink when I'm going on dates, because all dates happen in pubs and clubs and restaurants. And it's like, well, who says, you know? Who said that that has to be the case. But there's this concept, and I often say, and I truly believe this to be the case, that our generation wasn't taught to say no, and often we'd find ourselves in these awful situations because we were just too polite to tell somebody that we didn't want to do something, you know? And it was really interesting, I had my parents in law staying from New Zealand. They weren't staying in our house. They were staying in the accommodation across the road. And bless them, they were absolutely amazing. But it just was so how much has changed from you know, us finding out the kids are autistic, us sharing information around you. Autism and us kind of advocating and saying, you know, a bit like what Glennon Doyle wrote in her book untamed. You know, we won't bring your fear doesn't get to come into our house. But I remember being sat at the table at years gone by, and, you know, my kids would be told off because they'd be jumping around or not being able to sit down, or they'd be picking things up with their fingers, or they'd be saying something, you know, they'd be looking for attention, or they'd be talking over somebody, or they'd be whatever, and they'd get told off because in the days of your, your, your, do, your, I don't know if that's the right words the old and the old times. You know, children had to be convenient to their parents. You know, as a children's role was to mold into the parent requirements. It was about convenience. You know, I fight very hard against that in our family, probably to the point of the other way, where I probably bend over backwards for the children too, too far,
Unknown Speaker 16:09
and negate my own
Unknown Speaker 16:13
requirements.
Speaker 1 16:17
But then again, I think there's a fine line, isn't there, to a fine balance to be reached. Yeah, but it was great when my grand My in laws were here, because, you know, and I could see, you know, things that would probably have tipped them off a little bit before, but they just didn't say anything. And it was just so nice that everyone could just be themselves. And for me, I didn't have to carry the burden of everybody else's experience inside my body, which is something that I talk about a lot, but it's been a big deal for me. Like, one of the main reasons I used to drink was so I didn't have to feel that, you know. And we were talking about, you know, carrying the burden of intergenerational beliefs around servitude, around around, you know, and particularly for women, you know, what a woman's job is, you know. And this whole idea of selflessness, you know, it kind of, we were talking a little bit and kind of having a little giggle about it's not like they're all like Mary Magdalene and we're washing Jesus's feet. That's not what I'm talking about here. It's quite surreptitious, but it's thinking about everybody else before you make a decision. And I do find in my group, still a lot of humans who don't want to be drinking are drinking mainly because they're having to still put other people first, because it's safer for people, it's safer for them to put other people's needs first, and it is to take the risk of
Unknown Speaker 17:57
putting their own needs first,
Speaker 1 17:58
because what, and Again, this is, you know, makes sense intergeneration, it wasn't safe for us. That's why women are so good at masking. That's why I think, you know, so many autistic women are coming out of the woodwork now with their children being diagnosed. Because we are excellent at camouflaging. We are excellent at masking because intergenerationally, women had to be able to stuff down their feelings because, you know, marriage wasn't a nice place for most women most of the time. You know, it wasn't. It was they were abused a lot. I
Unknown Speaker 18:35
mean, it's very, very commonplace,
Speaker 1 18:39
you know, for women to be physically and mentally and sexually abused in the home.
Speaker 1 18:52
And so we do learn how to mask, and we do learn how to and a bit, but which is the suppression of self. So we suppress ourselves, masking suppression of self, suppression of self, in order to fit in and be accepted by the world around us. And again, you know, one of the main reasons that people who want to stop drinking find it difficult to stop drinking, particularly, you know, people who have very strong wounds around in a wounds around. You know, being alone, being worthy, being loved, being cared for, I'm unlovable, I'm unacceptable, I'm not worthy, I'm not good enough. You know, these are kind of like core basics, like most, it's like a core belief, 101, what most humans have is the thing that keeps them limited in their lives is those beliefs which mainly were formed pre verbal which is why it's been very interesting. I don't know those of you who've been following me during the presence process over the. Last fortnight, on and off, because I got sick in the middle of it, but it's been really interesting. You know, I was reading a piece of the presence process today, and he was talking about, you know, it's, it's our felt sense, it's our emotional experience. That's not verbal. It's pre verbal, that is, and it's that is, what is our reaction. So you know, when we get triggered by something, it's the felt sense of the reaction. So how we feel it's centrally in our body, which, again, can be really, really difficult for autistic people or neurodiverse people, because and women or female assigned at birth humans, because generally, we have pushed down our senses, so it's difficult for us to identify where and how we're feeling. But also because, you know, there is, you know, things like Alex ademia and intraoceptive awareness as well. So felt sense is interesting. But what I thought was really interesting about the felt sense piece and today and the presence process was that he was Michael Brown, who writes the presence process was saying, Actually, we don't need to verbalize it for it to for us to be able to process it, what we do need to be able to do is feel it. And so often I know I've been guilty of asking my guys and group, you know, what does it feel like to one of the questions we ask at the end of the grounding is, if this feeling had a voice, what does it want me to know?
Unknown Speaker 21:44
And that's classic, like turning it into language, isn't it?
Unknown Speaker 21:48
And so I guess it's that
Speaker 1 21:52
even trying to describe the sensation. Yes, I think it is useful to be able to do that,
Unknown Speaker 21:59
but also it's like
Unknown Speaker 22:03
it's actually about feeling, the feeling.
Unknown Speaker 22:07
And it doesn't matter how you feel that whether
Speaker 1 22:08
you can, I can articulate it, but it's about what you know, actually being in it, as opposed to running away from it. And so, of course, the feeling is going to be if we were to turn around to our partners and say, I'm not going to do X, Y and Zed with you on Saturday, because I'm exhausted. I've had a really busy week. I've been talking all week. I've been on my feet all week, and now I need to decompress. So I'm not going to do these little chores and I'm not going to run around for you, and I'm not going to keep my brain really busy. I'm going to rest. I'm going to do some restart, a bit of yoga. Go for a swim, go for a walk, and I'm going to really spend some time doing that, and I'm not going to be able to help you out. I'm not going to be able to take care of your cat. I'm not going to be able to take, you know, do some babysitting. I'm not going to be able to
Unknown Speaker 23:11
help you clear out your garden shed.
Unknown Speaker 23:14
I'm going to, hey, you know,
Unknown Speaker 23:18
I'm going to, I'm going to, I'm
Speaker 1 23:21
not going to do that because I need some restorative time for myself.
Unknown Speaker 23:27
What comes up for you?
Speaker 1 23:30
So I've had a situation today where I've had to say to my son, I really need a holiday.
Unknown Speaker 23:40
We've been through quite a lot the last
Speaker 1 23:43
bear with me a second. Just nearly lost Facebook. There we go. Been through quite a
Unknown Speaker 23:47
lot the last sort of 18 months. And
Speaker 1 23:51
I did manage to get away last year, but really need to get away this year. Need some time away. Need some need some sea, need some swimming. Need some reading books, need
Unknown Speaker 24:00
some so nice to see you, Cheryl,
Unknown Speaker 24:04
hope you're okay.
Speaker 1 24:07
Talking about servitude, talking about because it came up in the lighthouses,
Unknown Speaker 24:15
we're talking about putting everybody else first and
Speaker 1 24:18
putting our own needs last, and then needing to drink because it's such a big can of worms, and it's so exhausting, and we are completely overwhelmed centrally, usually,
Unknown Speaker 24:35
by the end of it.
Speaker 1 24:37
And so I just think it's really interesting just to spend the moment while we're here together, you know, just
Unknown Speaker 24:42
just having a feeling like, what
Unknown Speaker 24:44
would it? What does it feel like for you? You
Speaker 1 24:47
don't have to describe it. Just feel it when you put yourself first. So when I put myself first, I said to my son today, and he's very upset about it, as he's wanting to audition. Go to lots of auditions, and. Be players over the next couple of months, and that sort of prevents us from being able to go away. And I'd been like, Oh no, I should be supporting him. I should be going actually, on my knees tired, and I just had to go and say, Look, mate, you just need to not do anything for the next couple of months above. Go to work, go to school, see our friends, you know, to what we do in our activities, and that, let that be it, because we've been pushing ourselves so hard for so long, and we've had a lot of horrible stuff happening
Unknown Speaker 25:34
to our family,
Speaker 1 25:39
and I felt all kinds of things. Like I could feel up my tummy. I feel, I feel, you know, really heavy in my chest, and feeling my boobs, my lungs.
Unknown Speaker 25:54
And there's a fear as well as a fear in
Unknown Speaker 25:56
my tummy. I can feel it my tummy,
Speaker 1 25:58
like I'm afraid if I don't help him achieve his passions, that he will get
Unknown Speaker 26:05
really depressed,
Unknown Speaker 26:14
be unhappy, and I
Speaker 1 26:17
feel bad about that, feel sad about that, feel at my eyes so I encourage you just to spend a little bit of time feeling being with what comes up for you when you're thinking about
Unknown Speaker 26:33
putting your own needs first,
Speaker 1 26:36
you know? And of course, there's stories around it we tell ourselves, you know, what does it mean about me, and often I spend a lot of my time, you know, talking, you know, what does it mean about you, if you, you know, if you, if you are someone who You know,
Unknown Speaker 26:56
lets people down,
Unknown Speaker 26:59
isn't a good friend,
Speaker 1 27:02
yeah, isn't a good daughter, isn't a good sister, isn't a good whatever. What meaning do you make about that? That's one element of it, you know, if I, if I'm like that, you know, it might mean that I won't have a family, I won't have I'll be all alone.
Unknown Speaker 27:23
And what are we making that me?
Speaker 1 27:26
And then, you know, personally, I've been listening to Tara brach talking and just connected to a lot of other things as well about our interconnectedness. And you know how it serves sort of anger and separateness serves us. But if we can lean into the interconnectedness that we're part of, something that is, you know, we're one with nature. We are nature. I'm going to start us out a bit, but I but
Unknown Speaker 28:05
we are everything.
Speaker 1 28:07
And so we that wound that we received as very little children, that feeling that the parent was never going to come pick us up, and we're crying, we're trying to get us we can't go to sleep, or when we fell over and, you know, we didn't get the love, or when someone didn't believe us, when we're telling the truth, or someone hurt us, whatever, then that wound is still wandering around, making us feel the feelings of that little child.
Unknown Speaker 28:39
But we're grown ups now,
Speaker 1 28:42
and so it's like we'll feel that feeling with that little child, hold them in that distress. Let it be there. Let it be
Unknown Speaker 28:58
there. And
Unknown Speaker 29:05
we're going to keep that little child safe. Now
Speaker 1 29:08
it's us. It was us all along. We are coming to save us, no one else. Yeah, we're looking for everything outside, and it's inside only we can do it. Only we can create internal safety. Only we can keep ourselves safe. We have to learn to Mother ourselves, and by Mother, I'm talking about the ideal idea, concept of mother, unconditional love. That's the hardest thing. Okay, Esther, how you going? Good to see you.
Unknown Speaker 29:47
I'm just about to wrap up. So unconditional love is where I
Speaker 1 29:51
I've ended up. Talked about servitude. I mean, these are the other things, like anger. We felt so angry because we're suppressed. You know? I. Suppressing of self. You know, always putting everyone else first. But I'm resentful. I have an expectation that things are going to be a certain way, and I'm not. So I'm disappointed, yeah,
Unknown Speaker 30:14
but if we can feel the feeling,
Speaker 1 30:17
be with it. Let it be there. Give it room, give it air, hold it in its distress, love it and let it know that we are the solution. We're the only solution. We're the solution. And I don't mean that in a western, individualized culture, kind of you know, we are there. It's only us because it's only it's us because we're interconnected with everything, and it's that's why things like meditation, presence, being in nature, this is why they're so important. But serving ourselves rather than serving others is such an important generation to generational cycle to break,
Unknown Speaker 31:07
because when we break it, we break it for
Unknown Speaker 31:10
everybody else around us as well,
Speaker 1 31:13
and yes, it's not liked, because people is very, very useful to other people. When we're doing more than our fair share, and we're really knackering ourselves out to please them, but
Unknown Speaker 31:25
it's not helpful to us
Speaker 1 31:28
anyway. I'm gonna leave it there, because my kitchen's in use. My kitchen will be in use in a second. All right, my darlings, you take care. I hope that was useful. Lots of love. Look music. Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of midlife AF with Emma Gilmore. If you enjoyed it, please share on Instagram for your friends and tag me at Hope rising coaching. If you want to help me grow the podcast, please review the episodes for me on Apple podcast that really helps. If you would like to work further with me, please go to my website, www hope rising coaching.com for my free and paid programs, or email me at Emma at Hope rising coaching.com sending a massive cuddle to you and yours for me and mine, and remember to keep choosing you.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
